After weeks of work on over a dozen launch and immediate post-launch articles, our writers sat down for one last overview of the new edition of Horus Heresy, and to talk about what they liked, what they don’t, and what they’re excited to see next.
Let’s start with first impressions. How does the game feel compared to second edition? Is it a radical departure or business as usual?
Andrew N: At first glance, this is a HUGE departure from the game structure of second edition Heresy. The changes to the component sections of the game, the almost-excessive wordiness of the rules writing, and the massive changes to army list design will be a surprise to veteran players, many of which have been playing Heresy with minimal changes for a decade or longer. But after the initial shock wears off, it becomes obvious that the previous two editions of the game are the foundations that this edition is built on.
Also, an obligatory “DO NOT PANIC” to all of us noticing missing units and wargear options. This is a hard thing to defend – Heresy was always known as a refuge for players that wanted to use older units and have tons of customization. I do strongly believe that units will likely return in Legacies documents, or in Journal Tacticas, in the near future. So fellow veteran Heresy players, don’t freak out too much!
Editor’s Note: This roundtable was written well in advance of publication date, as it turns out people did.
The game feels more crunchy, that goes without saying. The more involved rules, the challenge phase that is a mini game unto itself, the list building system that will likely be a hobby on its own, these will require more commitment from a player to learn and understand. But as a tradeoff, there seems to be so much more flavor here. The additional rules seem to really lean into narrative gameplay, narrative in that the game allows the players to tell a story with their armies and characters as actors that tell their own part of the Horus Heresy drama. And with the Journal Tacticas, we will likely see more deep dives into the nooks and crannies of the Heresy war as well.
Jelly: The new system is a real step, but I’m not certain if it’s forward or backwards. It feels involved, maximalist, and poorly organised. In six months, we’ll either have all given up on the game entirely, or we’ll be having the time of our lives. Pure coin flip territory based on the community’s reception of shoddily written exciting rules. I’m certainly excited for the influx of new players and being able to run 5 Dreadnoughts without being socially exiled from my FLGS.
Lenoon: There’s one overriding feeling for me about the new edition: LENGTH. It feels long – there’s levels of complexity and nested systems in here that leave it feeling like a bit of an endurance test to get through. That’s in the rules writing, the turn structure, the reactions – the close combat rules particularly, where inside the charge phase you have a movement phase, a shooting phase, combat itself and a second, nested, combat system with the challenges, before you even get to resolution (and god forbid there’s any reactions there too) for each charging unit! Facing a World Eaters army on their big charge turn is going to be a long, long experience.
Soggy: When we first found out about the new edition, I must admit the first thing I thought was “Do we need a new edition?”. Maximalist rules writing style aside, after getting some turns in and getting my head around things the numerous changes to the core rules overall feel positive and address some oddities of the old edition while feeling like a similar play experience.
NotThatHenryC: It’s a big departure but not quite as big as it seems at first. Games Workshop’s marketing has clearly been trying to tell us that it’s the same game and there’s nothing to worry about, which is mostly true I think. There’s a lot of noise in these rules but the outcomes are going to be pretty similar to what we had before. You’ll have an army of roughly the same size and everything in it will function pretty much how it did before. Bolters still hit on a 3 and wound other Legionaries on a 4. Lascannons are still for shooting at tanks and it still hurts a lot to be hit by a Power Fist.
Max: I like it. I didn’t at first. But now I do. And you will too.
Meltabombed: I’ll start by saying that I’m definitely a Heresy KoolAid sipper; I LOVE this game and this setting, and would likely play it even IF it was dogshit. It’s what my friends and I play, and it is truly a passion I always come back to. That being said, I really don’t think it is. My first impression of this game is/was that while dense, a lot of things make a lot more sense. “This thing happens at this exact point in this process” make my life as an EO easier, and leads to fewer “feelbads” rules disagreements at the table or having to rely on community “interpretations.”
badusernametag: Kinda agree with Soggy here that my first thought was “really, do we need that?” For most Heresy players it is not a ‘competitive’ game that needs regular updates in the same manner as 40k or AoS. But HH2 did have multiple issues and rules hangups from previous rules that I didn’t enjoy. Once I finally sat down with the new rules I was at first confused and then then very pleased! The new rules writing style is a little thick and wordy. But once you get into it it’s much more logical. I feel like this is a rules set that will take a while to get your head around, but once you’re into it will be much easier to actually play. With many fewer special rules to check and caveats to remember. Maybe I’m optimistic, but I think this game will flow better. It also promises better balance and the units and their roles have been a lot more carefully considered and handled.
realSnice: Simply put, I’m a fan. Yes, I’m disappointed to see some options removed from units but this feels like the “best” version of Heresy yet if you can make it past that sense of loss. Yes, the rules are wordy, but they are better organized and remove ambiguity. There is better internal balance across the factions and inside of the factions. There is a significant reduction of the gap between “good” and “bad” choices. Heresy players search for the narrative in their games, and while we have lost some flexibility, the game itself feels so much more conducive to support two armies that let players create a story without sacrificing their own ability to simply play the game. I’ll be playing, I hope you do too.
What is your favourite new rule or sub-system?
Meltabombed: Beyond the just general clarity the new rules bring to the table, I really like the way Charging now works. Your units get to make a free “Set-Up” move determined by their Move + Initiative, then roll two D6 and pick the highest for your actual Charge Move. While essentially eliminating the possibility of a “long bomb” 12” Charge, this makes it basically impossible to fail a sub-4” charge and makes the mid-range Charge much more consistent. I also like the addition of the Volley Attack mechanic, wherein both units get to make some free Snap Shots at each other on the way into combat, but only with Assault traited weapons (like volkite chargers and most pistols) or models with something like Implacable Advance, like terminators, meaning your nasty Heavy Support Squad now needs to spend a precious Reaction to upgrade their Volley Attack to an Overwatch Reaction. On that note I like that players will need to be much more selective with where they spend their Reactions throughout the turn. There’s a lot to like about the new edition, but I think that core mechanic shift will shake up the game and make the Assault Phase much more interesting.
Jelly: The Challenge System rocks, particularly the instruction from the rules to put the models nearby on the coolest point. In a test game Max and I played, his Chaplain had a duel with my Centurion on top of the Storm Eagle the Death Guard has just landed in. This was an epic three round back and forth that proved a highlight of the game!
Max: Yeah, it’s got to be Challenges. I thought they’d be so unwieldy on my first read through. But now with a decent few games under my belt, it’s honestly one the best parts of the game for me. I find myself actively throwing my characters into combats I’d have shirked away from last edition.
Soggy: Oof, trying to pick one is tricky. There are so many changes that just picking one stand out is a bit of a challenge. While there’s a raft of time-consuming mechanics in 2.0 like Artificer armour or rerolls which have been abstracted in favour of more interesting ones such as the new challenge system, I think I’m going to have to go with changes to stats.
The extra granularity opens up a lot of design space for interesting options, such as having stats that represent a very potent yet craven psyker (high WP, low LD/CL). Meanwhile, multiple damage on weapons allows for more consistency across the board of weapons and targets – the difference in survivability on multi-wound models by increasing one Toughness due to the Instant Death mechanic felt very odd and gamey at times.
Common to some of the other rules changes in this edition, this is one of those changes which at first glance people questioned if it was necessary, but feels right and very Heresy once you get some games in and think about it.
Lenoon: I really liked reactions in 2.0, and like the changes here. As a filthy Ultramarines player the absolute ideal situation was to have Fulmentarus or Lascannons react multiple times in a turn – movement into cover, return fire, overwatch (bit less ideal with the heavy weapon squads there), reliably deleting huge sections of enemy army. Changing reactions to be per turn – a unit can only react *once* – is a subtle but substantial change and I think will serve to make reactions a more meaningful choice than always picking return fire.
NotThatHenryC: I’m also a big fan of having multi-damage weapons. The old system caused a lot of weirdness, like Dreadnoughts being too tough to kill. To function at all it needed all sorts of exceptions, like having Instant Death, which then required Eternal Warrior, and so on. Brutal in 2.0 was effectively a damage stat, though it was oddly implemented with a save against each wound and arbitrarily applied – missing out Knights, for example.
My favourite change might be rerolls, or rather the lack of them. It’s great to see the back of Heavy Artificer armour rerolling 2+ saves. My Raven Guard Dark Furies with either Hatred or Prefered Enemy used to roll 53 attacks which I needed to sort into hits, precision hits and misses, some or all of which I could reroll. Then I’d take my piles of precision hits and normal hits, roll both and sort them into rending hits, normal wounds and failures – all of which I’d reroll. I’m sure no opponent could ever really follow what I was doing. They’re quite a lot worse now without rerolls to wound but it’ll take far less time to resolve.
Badusernametag: Can it be the Removal of rules please?? I feel like the Special Rules section has been trimmed so nicely and many rules simplified or brought into a unit’s own entry etc. It’s just much cleaner and I’m really here for it! Combining rules, like for example the vehicle damage table is now reflected by Statuses, which are the same rules that effect infantry. Damage points being the same on hull points and wounds. There are multiple examples of the rules being slimmed down. So while they’re very long and wordy they’re also neater and will make for a faster, better game.
Damage points also! Down with instant death and the megaosity of Dreadnoughts!? The damage point system slaps! I’m not sure that the granularity of multiple levels of breaching is necessarily better than just a subtraction AP system (like 40k), but I guess that remains to be seen. Maybe it’s a quintessential Heresy thing we just can’t dump! I’m pumped for HH3 lets GO!?!
realSnice: Army building! The way one selects their force is a significant departure from what have known in past editions, but I am excited to see a army structure that really feels like it came straight out of the novels.
How have your games of Heresy third edition gone so far?
Soggy: They’ve gone pretty well. The hardest part for me was not the game itself but getting ready for it due to the different options with army creation – previously I would pick one of my Legion’s Rites of Wars, which kind of decided what I was going to take. Not having as tight restrictions is very freeing, and does make sense given the Legions were legion – but that much choice can also be a bit daunting. I’m very looking forward to an army builder dropping to make this process easier, as this is the biggest barrier for me to get games in at the moment.
Once on the table while playing our first game or two, the learning curve is absolutely there – having to completely relearn the rules from scratch as many things which have been consistent for a very long time have had subtle but meaningful changes. Once we had a few games or even turns in, things started to flow and feel about right.
Lenoon: I’m going to be totally honest here and say that the main thing I did in my test games was be a real beardy bastard with the terrain rules. There’s a learning curve everywhere but the biggest one might be medium terrain. You can, if you were minded to, do absolutely horrific things with model placement and medium terrain. Blocking line of sight to your models but not from them is doable in the right shape ruins, but so is leaving your heavy weapon squads unable to shoot because they can’t see beyond the edge of the terrain they’re hiding in. It might be a shock after the second edition but we’re going to have to actually learn and use the terrain rules, team.
On a non-cheesy note, I really enjoyed test games with the Knights. They could perhaps be a little better but they’re a much more interactive, fun and interesting faction to play now.
Meltabombed: That’s a good point; we all picked up on the terrain rule weirdness, and while I saw it as an abusable and likely unintended consequence, you rolled with it and figured out how to use it to your advantage.
Specifically, “Medium” terrain provides a 5+ Cover Save, but it also blocks Line of Sight if drawn through 3” or more of the terrain leading to some really weird interactions especially with units that occupy the same piece of terrain. For example, a unit wanting to Charge another unit in Medium Terrain would need to be within 3” of it to even declare the Charge in the first place, which seems unintended. With Ruins being the most likely type of terrain people have in their collections and likely wanting to use it as “Medium” terrain for the classic 5+ Cover Save it grants, this is going to catch a lot of people out and cause a lot of arguments.
Coming at it from an EO perspective, Andrew, Snice, and I immediately began thinking about how to make a blanket ruling or Event-wide rule to try to avoid the weirdness and let people focus on learning the new game as a whole rather than getting caught up on this one small outlier rule in an otherwise (in my view at least) elegant system.
Otherwise, I think the game feels really good to play and will feel very familiar to players once they chew through all the verbosity.
NotThatHenryC: So far I’ve found transport vehicles very different and I think they’ll make a much bigger impact than in 2.0. They’re proving to be much tougher and that has made a big impact on how you use them. There are units that become significantly better now that you can get them across the board much more reliably.
I had a game against Soggy where I charged 10 Cataphractii into a Land Raider and did almost nothing to it. Soggy’s Cataphractii retinue inside then got out and smashed my 10 normal guys up. The difference between WS4 and 5 is enormous, as is the retinue’s extra attack. If that retinue had been on foot then I could have shot them dead and previously I could have probably shot the Land Raider fairly easily. Not now.
Badusernametag: I’ve been on holidays in Sicily to be frank, so whilst the rest of these goons have been shuffling their droogs through medium terrain I’ve been eating gelato and reading rules on the beach. Super excited to get going with games of HH3 soon!!
realSnice: Games have started slow. There are enough changes that you really need to check that you’re doing things the correct way. But once that first game is over, it all comes together quickly.
Andrew N: Like everyone else has said, the first few games were a slog, trying to play exactly by the new rule set can be tough at first. However, after a few more reps, it starts to click – you realize some functions are very similar to their previous iterations, and new ones (like challenges) are a lot more straightforward than the novel of rules they have makes them seem to be. Honestly, Challenges are pretty straightforward, we could really use a cheat sheet for all the Gambits, though!
What change is absolutely going to trip Heresy veterans up?
Andrew_N: List building is going to be a big adjustment for veteran players (and for new ones, to be completely honest), but I don’t see that as being a bad thing. The expansion of the traditional Force Organization Chart to multiple detachments, each unlocked in different ways (often through the taking of Command units), and the expansion of unit types outside the traditional HQ, Elites, Troops, Fast Attack, and Heavy Support will allow veterans to really revisit their approach to building out their armies. It also gives opportunities to breathe new life into your force – by swapping out certain detachments and units, your army can have a completely different vibe and playstyle, despite using the same army rules and core units. Despite not starting out that way, my Salamanders army evolved into more of a mechanized assault army through the end of first and most of second edition, where I had intended to play it as a more heavy infantry/close quarters force. The new FOC system gives me the ability to do that, with heavy infantry taking and holding objectives, and assault units going for the enemy – something that I could not do easily when those units often had to compete for the same FOC slots in the older rulesets.
Meltabombed: Some rules no longer mean what they used to or function how they have for over a decade. This wouldn’t be so bad if they ALL changed, but that also isn’t the case. Hatred grants +1 to Wound against the Hated foe, Shred is +1 Damage on a certain die-roll, and Rending is an auto-wound on a certain TO HIT roll and no longer grants automatic AP2. Twin-Linked and other such re-rolls are basically completely gone from the game, but Feel No Pain is still a Damage Mitigation Roll (just a lot rarer).
Be careful Heresy Veterans, read all of your rules very carefully because you should not take for granted that you know what a rule does or how something works. The wordiness of the rules is a lot to digest at first, but once you get it, I think it will translate into being easily taught by word of mouth; you just have to make sure you know what all the rules do! Take some time, use cheat sheets or reference cards, and take your first couple games slowly working your way through every rule and you’ll pick it up quick, I promise!
NotThatHenryC: I agree the biggest issue is going to be thinking you know what a rule like Shred means, only to discover that it’s something completely different now.
On the tabletop, I think that only being able to charge one unit is quite a big deal. In the past it made sense to field big death stars that you could ram into an enemy army. I’m not sure that’s still true if they end up spending their time swatting screening units aside without reaching any juicy targets. It may still be worth putting a lot of power into the midfield but perhaps spread across a few smaller units. Of course smaller units are less good at making use of your limited allocation of reactions.
Combined with not getting +1A on the charge any more, the lack of rerolls from things like Hatred and no-longer wiping out fleeing enemies, melee looks quite a bit weaker overall. It’s probably still essential for taking and holding objectives, however. The new balance between melee and shooting is something we’re all going to have to practice a bit to figure out.
Max: Expect games to take 30 mins longer whilst you rewire your brain.
Badusernametag: Statuses. Whilst it takes a minute to adapt to a change in what a rules does (Shred etc), the new statuses are a very new animal and I think they come up more than you think. Even with some weeks of reading I have to go back to check the difference between Suppressed and Stunned etc. They’re a big facet of the game now in a way that Pinning touched on in HH2, but bigger and meaner.
Army construction also take a MINUTE to get your head around. Apps will need reworking and so theres gonna be a lot of paper lists and head scratching for a bit.
realSnice: Infiltrating is different now. Read those order of operations closely when starting your game.
What is the unit that surprised you most in the new edition?
Lenoon: You know what, I think it will be fun to fight a Reaver Titan. That is surprising!
Jelly: I’m really excited about Tarantulas. If you deploy first you can position incredibly aggressively with infiltrators, and despite having Expendable they can still hold objectives no problem. Plus they’re BS4 and cost pennies. I’ll be running a little firebase of these in every list I can find the detachment space.
Flyers might actually be usable now? My Storm Eagle was also instrumental in test games, dropping my big Grave Warden brick exactly where I wanted them and helping them score key points with their Vanguard (3). Am I going to need a second plane? Is a Thunderhawk Gunship finally viable? Oh no.
NotThatHenryC: Being able to assault out of Rhinos now has the potential to be huge. Even without charging the fact you can move the Rhino 12” and then move 7” gives your infantry an enormous reach.
I’m also pleased to see more units seeming like they might be useful. Outriders have finally got 2 wounds which, combined with Vanguard (1) and amazing Volley Firing, might make them a pretty effective unit. I’d love it if they made a plastic model for them.
Lenoon: Rhino (and Dracosan) Rush is back, baby!
Max: It’s not just Rhinos. All tanks feel amazing to play with. The bump in HP, damage table changes and decrease in pen boosts/re-rolls means that most tanks can now take a punch or two without folding like wet paper. Basically all the Astartes tanks have got a new lease on life: The Predator is a bloody workhorse with most of their turret options seeming very viable now. Land Raiders feel very tough with AV14 being even harder to pen than it used to be. Vindicators (both types!) are great and Kratoses can be downright monstrous if you’ve left your meltas at home. But, Scorpii suck ass. RIP.
Badusernametag: I’m with Max here, as a big fan of tanks and Land Raiders in particular I am PUMPED at the changes. Land raiders (and Kratos and other av14) feel really tough now and will take some punishment! My love for vindicators is now vindicated and they should demolish walls, tanks and terminators as they should do!!
Going against the grain (quel surprise) I am pleasantly surprised by the streamlining of the legion hero classes. I think it’s entirely appropriate that specialists be actually specialised and have no problem with restricting their wargear. It’s really great to see Centurions stepping up and getting a proper role. I feel bad for those who converted a bike primus medicare with a power fist and all, but you can use that model for something and I really feel the game will benefit from this streamlining.
Soggy: While I’m pleased vehicles are better now, I do wonder if perhaps we’ve swung too hard the other way. Time will tell.
realSnice: Seekers are… spicy. Very, very, very, spicy.
Soggy: Seekers are a big problem. For me, my Acheron’s flamer was hopelessly ineffective for second edition. It’s rather terrifying now, with the ability to inflict massive amounts of Panic checks and murder marines outright if I chose to stand still.
What will your first hobby project of the new edition be?
Andrew_N: With the Salamanders seeker/recon squad completed for the model preview done, I likely need to get some tactical marines built and painted. I didn’t wait a decade for plastic MkII marines to not run big blocks of them on the table! After that, I will likely need to convert some command sections for my Solar Auxilia – I ran few if any in the last two editions and now it seems likely I will need quite a few!
Soggy: You heard it here folks, Andrew is a cheesy WAAC’er making Salamanders seekers with preview kit and inside knowledge*.
*I realize satire is dead, but this is a joke for those in the back.
Andrew_N: GUILTY. I might break a 10% win rate now!
Jelly: Plane hype continues. For years now I’ve been planning a Solar Auxilia Rifle regiment jumping out of Arvus Lighters (made of Avatar toy helicopters) and I may need a couple dozen Veletarii to fill up my copters. After that, I’ll be hard at work on a tooled-up Dusk Raiders Terminator Command Squad, so I can get even more silly with all my planes.
NotThatHenryC: Maybe outriders. I actually have some scout bikes that I converted a while ago to stick mk7 marines on. I might bring those out of retirement with new riders (the top half at least) and a bit of black paint, to join my Raven Guard. I do probably need to do a few Rapiers too.
Max: I think the new Mark II is sick. Similarly to Andrew, I think I’ll be working on getting all the boys from the Saturnine box table ready before I move onto anything else. I did say to myself I wouldn’t be building a new army this edition, but honestly the flexibility of Allied detachments means that ‘splashing’ in for a unit or two from another Faction is easier than ever, and now my brain is cooking. Inevitably I’ll end up picking up a unit of Castellax or Lasrifle Section in the near future.
Meltabombed: Oh man, where to start! I’m definitely excited to start working more on my burgeoning Thousand Sons, but I also think it might be time to dust off my Blood Angels Flyers and give them an updated coat of paint since I think they’ll be seeing more table time this go around!
Badusernametag: Ok breathe. So many ideas! I am keen to redo my World Eaters of first ed and also repainted all my thousands of points of Renegade Militia. First though I think will be some Knigets! I’ve been really excited to build a little kniget army for a little while and now is the time to follow it through. With all the organic components, teeth and gubbins you could hope for!!! Literally first I’m adding some Saturnine Termies and a Praetor to my Night Lords!
realSnice: After reading through the Libers, I want it all? Mechanicum look absolutely awesome in this edition and while I am a Marine player at heart, I can’t wait to buff out my slowly growing force.
Final thoughts?
Andrew_N: Overall, I have a very positive outlook on the new edition. I am a bit wary of some of the changes to unit composition, and a bit frustrated about missing units or weapon options, but after my first few games and rules readthroughs I think that the new ruleset provides a strong foundation for Heresy to be built on. The new ruleset gives a ton of opportunity for story based narrative play, and the focus on using Journal Tacticas for more niche unit design and campaign play means we will likely see an expansion of the Heresy narrative as we know it. My hopes are that the Heresy community will grow and expand as a result – I have met some amazing people through the Heresy community in the eastern US and at events, and would love to see more people of all kinds learning about one of the most interesting games and game settings offered by GW!
Meltabombed: The removal of some weapon options, custom character loadouts, and individual creativity in certain wargear choices really sucks, there are no two ways about that. I think a lot of players, myself included, will feel bitter about the time, money, and effort that went into converting and painting their models that are no longer usable, at least to a WYSIWYG standard. There’s no justification or sugar-coating that will salve that particular wound and I won’t try to.
That being said, I do truly feel like this is the best edition of Heresy that I have played (playing and collecting since 2017), and I think that if people avoid kneejerk reactions and can come to terms with the reduced options they have, I think they will really really enjoy it. For example, I think some units that were basically useless last edition will have a lot of play now, like Flyers and Outriders, and the removal of the Heavy armor-save rerolls means that Blasts feel really great to play again.
Just give this edition a chance and don’t let (entirely fair and justified) negative feelings out of the gate stop you from enjoying it for however many more years we have it. Also you never know, your favorite unit or loadout could come back at some point in the future!
Lenoon: Unfortunately I think I’m going to end up in a different place than everyone else. I like a lot of the changes here, but adding them all up makes a game that I’m not enthused about. It’s something that I will play at events (weirdo knights coming to a GHO near you – provided near you means Leicester), but I won’t be playing this at my gaming club or at home. Too lengthy, too overly complex – there are games with more strategic and tactical nous around that are kinder on the brain.
Soggy: As mentioned with my impression at the start of this article, I think there are a number of overall positive changes to the mechanics of the system (although not with how they are written at all).
I am less sure of balance or consistency with some units (seekers) or faction specific units or between Legion traits themselves – I’m looking at you Raven Guard. While Heresy isn’t necessarily pitched towards competitive tournament scenes, imbalance like this ultimately hurts casual players the most – people who love dreadnoughts were frowned upon at the start of 2.0, and this could be the case for several things in 3.0. If Heresy was app based akin to 40K or AoS, some of these things could be addressed electronically once a wider consensus is reached, but the established pattern for Heresy is once printed these things are set in stone, which feels like a real missed opportunity.
Games Workshop have done a great job at releasing so many libers for the plastic armies at launch and have already announced the schedule for others such as Custodes, Shattered Legions, Militia and Daemons – who will not have to wait as long as they did last time to hit the table.
That said, the elephant in the room is the lack of wargear options for many characters and units – initially appearing that we might be only getting printed rules for models which are currently sold by Games Workshop. The key thing I have to state here is that we haven’t seen the Legacies PDFs yet, which is where I am hoping to find these options. Realistically, this isn’t going to be the case, at least initially – these PDFs are living documents so they could change. As a White Scars player – I have many characters on bikes which currently do not exist, including the Khagan himself.
I am interested to see where they go with the Journal format, akin to their Old World counterparts, as the mini book format gives them more flexibility to drop these more often. Already with the first journal they have shown interest in mixing up certain mechanics with the Master of Descent. I’m hoping these don’t get too much to track in a year or two’s time.
Max: Honestly I’m just bewildered by the deletion of some wargear choices on units. Presumably this is so we’ll buy more of them. When they’re out of stock 90% of time. It just feels like a very corporate, profit maximisation based change. Do you know what doesn’t feel like that but still increases the marketisation of your product base without pissing people off? Making your force org incredibly flexible and being very permissive about taking other units from another Faction through Allies. There’s always been some interesting commercial decision making going on in Nottingham, it just sucks to see it so blatantly and it sucks that I now can’t play with models I spent ages working on. Other than this, the game is good.
NotThatHenryC: I’ve got several converted units that I can’t use at all any more and it’s very annoying. Even things like a command squad I made with resin bolters bought from Forgeworld at considerable expense in one hand and melee weapons in the other, because what the rules were, are now not legal. I’m not sure I ever even fired those damn bolters, as doing so would tend to let my opponent return fire with something worse. It’s extremely frustrating to have stuff like this that I’ve done in good faith, and paid GW a lot of money to do, get written off.
I get why they did it. The Heresy community has a lot of 3D printed stuff and I’m sure GW doesn’t like that. They may wonder why they should write rules so that other people can make models to profit off them. I’d argue that this situation was one GW created, by only doing half the job of creating the needed upgrades. It shouldn’t have shocked anyone that people wanted ways to make core troop units like Breachers, Despoilers and Assault squads, which have only very slowly become available. And even then, there was no need at all to take the options away from characters, especially just after releasing a melee weapon upgrade sprue.
Personally I find myself in a bit of a tricky situation. I do like the game and I think the new edition is a big improvement, overall. But my own main army is Raven Guard and I really don’t like their rules. The new Saturnine stuff and MK2 armour doesn’t fit my army’s aesthetic either. The logical thing would be to make a new army and I’ve put some thought into that, including doing a test Son of Horus that I’m quite happy with. But it’s an awful lot of effort and expense to do that. My current plan is to take my Raven Guard to an event or two, see how much I like the game in practice, and make a decision from there. Maybe I could do something completely different, like Solar Auxilia.
Badusernametag: Whilst initially skeptical of the whole notion of a new edition and then unimpressed by the verbosity of the rules writing, I am now very optimistic for the new ed! The rules seem to flow much better and actually thought has gone into units, their function and role in the army. Alt armies like knights and Mech have a different role and everything seems to have been designed in tandem for a concise whole game.
I think I am less affected than many by the drop of certain character load outs and units. That and that my models tend to be weird and I really don’t care that much what they’re armed with. Being honest. I’m sure there will be some gnashing of teeth, but I’m sure you can use your models as something and lets wait for that Legends compilation before freaking out.
I’m excited to play some HH3 and all the armies I want to play now seem to have a place. Lets make Heresy!
realSnice: I can’t wait to play more and start this new edition with a local slow grow campaign. This game isn’t perfect, and I don’t think it ever will be, or could be. Yet despite the loss of some war gear and specific Rites of War (hopefully returning in the future in some form), this does feel like the most thoughtfully designed edition of Heresy. It replicates the massive volume of lore in the setting but does so without so many feelsbad moments when playing. I will not miss Artificer Armor tanking 40 volkite shots but I do miss some of the wacky ways we could make characters. I hope that we as both players and hobbyists continue to get more ways to be creative in how we make Heresy armies and play games with them.
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